tweak superpowered classes to basics

ConsciouS-0nE
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Posts: 740

tweak superpowered classes to basics

Post#1 » 24 Nov 2016, 15:20

In order to match assault class on well balance;
Other class main problems

Sniper current accuracy
100%s
100%m
100%l
Makes it a superpower
Sniper shouldn't be good at close range
Lets say that the robot doest stop looking at the scope(in other games mostly fps, you get killed by a knife when your just scoping long range, blinded by point of veiw)
So lets put the sniper always looking at scope
10%s
60%m
100%l

Shotgun current accuracy
75%s
25%m
5%s

Shotgun short range dwelers
But in game can shoot precisely on long range and medium makes its a superpower and it has higher tick rate
Bulletspread so make it
75%s
20%m
1%l

Machinegun current accuracy
80%s
50%m
10%l

Machine guns this goliath superpower
Seems good no?
Nope, snipers but ticker armor and health with bullets sliced in rounds,
Making it enable to shoot long range does it.

So
80%s
55%m
5%l

Buts thats just the accuracy
And makes the rock paper scissors more inevitable

Currently
Sniper > all 3
Shotgun > all 3
Machinegun > all 3
assault > meh


But if 5.3 focuses 'programing' rather than best class composed team
Then the highly recommended thing would be

Force players to play the same random bots on random maps
Let the server decide on maps and equal class setups on it
Ex.
server picks mind game
Server picks
One machine gun and one assault
Or shotguns on each
Or etc
I find no problem on that
So everyone will be intoduced on 'Ranking Rules' for competition

The worry about 'the players will have no choice' isnt even an issue for me,
They want to compete they should follow the rules

5.4 would have private/local/quick play anyways
Last edited by ConsciouS-0nE on 25 Nov 2016, 17:32, edited 1 time in total.
Im not the best player, but atleast im something.I'm 8
Science is madness! 3:)

pier4r
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Posts: 3390

Re: if classes preserved

Post#2 » 24 Nov 2016, 15:38

"Force players to play the same random bots on random maps "

I'm in for this, because with this there is not so much balancing issues and players will not feel robbed of control if they have both the same possibilities.
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ConsciouS-0nE
Autonomous Entity
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Posts: 740

Re: if classes preserved

Post#3 » 24 Nov 2016, 15:55

The main problem about this would be
DRAWS

But if people will create more ais that counter possibilities to overcome draws for competition that would make it

Then the problem on that is
'If the most simple ais always win'

Thats the main curse
If you have 99 bugs and fixed one
You have 98 bugs,
Reality check press f5
Bugs count: 101
Im not the best player, but atleast im something.I'm 8
Science is madness! 3:)

pier4r
Skynet
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Posts: 3390

Re: if classes preserved

Post#4 » 24 Nov 2016, 16:15

"The main problem about this would be
DRAWS"

Why? Before with only one class we did not have such amount of draws. Imagine with a random setup of bots.
http://www.reddit.com/r/Gladiabots/wiki/players/pier4r_nvidia_shield_k1 -> Gladiabots CHAT, stats, insights and more ;

HDeffo
Neural Network
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Posts: 212

Re: if classes preserved

Post#5 » 24 Nov 2016, 19:48

I don't understand why you have a problem with sniper short ranges or shotgun long ranges.... at short range because all bots have high accuracy every not is 100 % chance to hit majority of their bullets. This causes the sniper to have a HORRIBLE short range DPS suffering at only a fraction of every other bot. As for long range shotgun that 5% is a percent spot. At that accuracy you actually deal damage slower than shields regenerate! Shotguns can't even hurt anything at all at long range with 5% so no need for 1%. At long range the shotgun should be able to deal a whopping 600 damage every 4.4 seconds, shields start their recharge at 3

ConsciouS-0nE
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Posts: 740

Re: if classes preserved

Post#6 » 25 Nov 2016, 05:21

bout the shotgun
Your talking about ONE shotgun
Make it five youll have 25% dps on long range
Making it 1% just makes swarms 5% max

Havent you see a dancing shotgun strategy? Moslty ritter,ntk?,jdb,mgb?

They set shotgun to fire short or med then when the target losses a couple of shield it retreats to long range and just fire until enemy down

Snipers cant counter shotguns at close?
Nah make make it in numbers youll still gonna see how good they are,
Its the superpower class

Mg shooting long range,
One doest scratch alot
Make it with numbers.

@pier
Same nodes same ais would result draw on 5.x
Cuz 4.x has bullet randomness
But as i said if people make ais to counter more possibilities it will make it ,then
<if simple ais would always win
Im not the best player, but atleast im something.I'm 8
Science is madness! 3:)

ConsciouS-0nE
Autonomous Entity
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Posts: 740

Re: if classes preserved

Post#7 » 25 Nov 2016, 08:06

The parents of unbalanced things are the classes and will give birth on even more complex things

The point of this is to make the other classes in the level of 'assault' class

Making them just 'basic' classes,
If you guys want more classes
Superpowered ones( enhanced)
Ex.- grenade launcher-from shotgun
Tanker - from machinegun
Medic - from assault

Because MAYBE gfx will just stick on one class soon, theyre goin extinct
Im not the best player, but atleast im something.I'm 8
Science is madness! 3:)

Johnbob
Algorithm
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Posts: 62

Re: if classes preserved

Post#8 » 25 Nov 2016, 10:51

Medic ! I didn't think of this one, very good idea !!

As for the balance: I find it good these days (except for assault of course).

mcompany
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Posts: 872

Re:tweak superpowered classes to basics

Post#9 » 25 Nov 2016, 17:43

ConsciouS-0nE wrote:Havent you see a dancing shotgun strategy? Moslty ritter,ntk?,jdb,mgb?

They set shotgun to fire short or med then when the target losses a couple of shield it retreats to long range and just fire until enemy down

Do note that while I don't think I've found a good counter to this strategy, I have noticed that my own attempts to recreate it get beaten by the mission ai (which only uses assault), so I doubt it is really overpowered

ConsciouS-0nE
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Posts: 740

Re: tweak superpowered classes to basics

Post#10 » 25 Nov 2016, 18:21

Even my pushing bug stategy gets beaten up on solo missions
I didnt even won once on assault
And said its overpowered.

But the thing is, its the parents of the unbalanced and will evolved on more complex things when not fixed soon.

When you set things they're not supposed to do thats when things usually happens.
Im not the best player, but atleast im something.I'm 8
Science is madness! 3:)

mcompany
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Posts: 872

Re: tweak superpowered classes to basics

Post#11 » 25 Nov 2016, 18:37

Well actually, if a strategy loses to the mission version of the ai (which for most missions is crazily bad), then that almost guarantees that your strategy can easily be beaten by a normal rock paper scissors, and no one has caught on yet. I actually bench test my AIs against the missions occasionally and change them if I notice the strategy loses a mission because that guarantees that a pure machine gun strategy (or a better version of that current strategy) will beat you. (And yes my version of all of my AIs can beat the missions, even when changing all machine guns to assaults)

That said, my point is that while they are the hardest current strategy to counter (without risking getting beaten by any other strategy), they are by no means overpowered or even close to overpowered

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