1min extra

collot999
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1min extra

Post#1 » 21 Dec 2016, 11:34

Hi, are you bored for lose points by draws, me yes, specially if you are winning.
Please, if in time out is draw, add a minute for have a winner.

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Avaren
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Re: 1min extra

Post#2 » 21 Dec 2016, 12:15

How much time is enough time?

The limit is there to ensure games aren't too long, if you're running out of time, try a different strategy.
You could try to be more aggressive in the Kill modes, try to get a resource or two earlier in the Capture mode, or perhaps come up with something else.

You only need to be 1 resource or 1 bot ahead (for Capture and Kill modes respectively) to win the game instead of draw in the case of a time out.

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NullPointer
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Re: 1min extra

Post#3 » 21 Dec 2016, 12:48

I think time could vary between maps. Something like:

- Circle of Death 1:30 min
- Seven Wonders 3:00 min
- Split Team 4:00 min
- Mind Game 2:00 min
- Set Your Priorities 4:00 min
- Barred Spirral 4:00 min
- Kingmaker 3:00 min
- Meeting Point 4:00 min

pier4r
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Re: 1min extra

Post#4 » 24 Dec 2016, 21:49

Avaren wrote:How much time is enough time?

The limit is there to ensure games aren't too long, if you're running out of time, try a different strategy.
You could try to be more aggressive in the Kill modes, try to get a resource or two earlier in the Capture mode, or perhaps come up with something else.

You only need to be 1 resource or 1 bot ahead (for Capture and Kill modes respectively) to win the game instead of draw in the case of a time out.


While I agree, one could use overtime. So draws would be still possible but unlikely.

Overtime would also avoid set fixed special value for maps, instead they will depend on the opponents.
I strongly agree with overtime, because it is cool. In quakelive when a big match ends in overtime (same with football) it is very exciting to watch and, if you are playing, it let's the player pump adrenaline.

Like:

Code: Select all

If result= draw and timeleft=0 and ( botTeamA.count > 0 OR botTeamB.count > 0 ) then
  //note that result=draw already fix the mode
  message "overtime!"
  timeleft += 60 seconds
  //note, in some cases matches will be endless so a limit of N overtimes should be set
end if


Or tie breaks (but those are ugly imo, overtime is more exciting)

Code: Select all

If result= draw and timeleft=0 and ( botTeamA.count > 0 OR botTeamB.count > 0 ) then
  //note that result=draw already fix the mode
  health_teamA = 0
  foreach (bot in teamA) do
    health_teamA += bot.health
  end for
 
  health_teamB = 0
  foreach (bot in teamB) do
    health_teamB += bot.health
  end for
 
  decide_winner(health_teamA , health_teamB)
  //note that in this case a player with one full bot can win a player with 3 bots but almost destroyed
end if
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J7Luke
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Re: 1min extra

Post#5 » 29 Dec 2016, 05:52

+1 to the overtime idea. I am new to the game and already end in OT a lot in League 2. I only imagine it will get worse in higher Leagues.

pier4r
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Re: 1min extra

Post#6 » 29 Dec 2016, 11:40

J7Luke wrote:+1 to the overtime idea. I am new to the game and already end in OT a lot in League 2. I only imagine it will get worse in higher Leagues.


Unlikely. Normally one wins or gets obliterated in less than 2 minutes
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NullPointer
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Re: 1min extra

Post#7 » 29 Dec 2016, 11:52

My big list of draws disagrees with that ;)

And each draw = -2 victories atm unfortunately. I'll be back to 1600s/1700s very soon.

pier4r
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Re: 1min extra

Post#8 » 29 Dec 2016, 13:45

Ok then, +1 for overtime. Draws means that the opponents improved! That's the fun!
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NullPointer
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Re: 1min extra

Post#9 » 29 Dec 2016, 14:49

Yes, it's really tough now, I can see a few new players with very good AIs. I still can't beat Mehran in Meeting Point and Set Your Priorities and I expect he improved his Mind Game AI and I'll lose next game, but at least I had a comeback against lobotek in 7 Wonders.

I think Kill Them All maps could use an extra minute. In Split Team and Barred I'm 50/50 between victories and draws, and every single draw the enemy is cornered 2-5 squares away from the edges.

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NullPointer
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Re: 1min extra

Post#10 » 31 Dec 2016, 19:46

I need real bad 1 or 2 extra minutes in Split Team and Barred Spiral.

I have 12 draws in 50 matches. 24% is too much.

Improving my AIs won't change much, to end a match in 3 minutes you need to have a considerable advantage in the AI.

pier4r
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Re: 1min extra

Post#11 » 31 Dec 2016, 20:01

I'm for overtime. It is generic and exciting.
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GFX47
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Re: 1min extra

Post#12 » 01 Jan 2017, 13:11

I can test new countdown by maps in a first iteration.

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NullPointer
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Re: 1min extra

Post#13 » 01 Jan 2017, 13:53

Nice! Just to give you an idea, these are my last 3 matches:

Image

And this is how they usually end:

Image

I lost count of how many times this happened last week.

My defeat rate for last week is ~10% and my draw ratio is ~15%.

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GFX47
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Re: 1min extra

Post#14 » 01 Jan 2017, 22:21

Could you please give me a list of the maps you think should get a longer timer?

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NullPointer
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Re: 1min extra

Post#15 » 01 Jan 2017, 22:47

- Split Team
- Barred Spirral
- Meeting Point

Tbh, I'd prefer to have 5 or even 10 minutes in all maps, I like to either win or lose, no draws. Maybe limited time will be more interesting if we could use time-based conditions.

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Re: 1min extra

Post#16 » 01 Jan 2017, 22:52

+1 for 5 minutes in all maps. It is generic and 5 minutes are very long in combat, considering that with right conditions a bot gets destroyed in some 30 seconds or less.
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GFX47
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Re: 1min extra

Post#17 » 01 Jan 2017, 22:57

OK let's try 5 minutes for all maps.

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NullPointer
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Re: 1min extra

Post#18 » 01 Jan 2017, 23:12

Thanks!!

pier4r
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Re: 1min extra

Post#19 » 02 Jan 2017, 09:14

I love gfx that always listen but also reflect on the requests.
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Wooolf
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Re: 1min extra

Post#20 » 02 Jan 2017, 18:09

Kill em all type maps don't benefit from a time limit, the only purpose it surves is to 'draw' matches that are a two way dance.
On this note you can reduce the number of draws by counting total team health at the end if both teams are still standing.

For best score maps, a long time limit would make it similar to kill em all. Because you could prioritize killing the enemy in a long drawn battle.
I think that best score maps should have a very short time limit. This will encourage tactics that are significantly different from kill em all. To discourage rushes for draws you could add a point multiplier so victories would be worth more.

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